ok so ive been going back and forth on this for probably two months now and i need someone to just tell me im overthinking it. my situation is a pretty average suburban backyard, maybe 60 feet wide and the HOA isnt thrilled about visible antennas so im trying to keep things low profile. right now i have a simple 40m dipole slung between two trees, maybe 25 feet at the apex, ends drooping down a bit because i just dont have the height. it works, i get out, but i keep reading about verticals and wondering if im leaving something on the table especially for DX.

the thing is every time i read about verticals for 40m everyone goes straight into radial systems and ground losses and honestly that whole conversation makes my head spin a bit. i understand the theory but putting down 32 or 64 radials in a backyard that my wife actually uses is not going to happen. so im looking at elevated radials maybe 4 of them, but then some guys say thats enough and others say youre just building a compromise.

anyone actually compared these two setups on 40m at real suburban heights? not simulation, actual on air results. my dipole at 25 feet is probably closer to a cloud warmer than a real DX antenna anyway so maybe the vertical wouldnt even be worse.

honest answer — at 25 feet on 40m your dipole is doing most of its work at fairly high angles so yeah youre not really optimized for DX either way. a vertical with even 4 elevated radials is going to have a lower angle of radiation and you'd probably notice it on the longer paths, like into EU from the east coast or into JA from the west. that said the difference isnt going to blow your mind. you might work stuff you werent working before but youre not going to suddenly be running DX pileups.

the elevated radial thing is fine as long as theyre actually elevated, like a few feet off the ground minimum and resonant or close to it. people underestimate how much slop you can get away with if theyre up in the air rather than laying on lossy ground. 4 radials at about 6 feet elevation has worked decently for me on 40 and 80. i ran that setup for about a year before i got my dipole up higher and honestly i didnt feel like i was suffering too badly.

if the HOA is a concern the vertical might actually be more stealth depending on what you use — a fiberglass fishing pole with wire on it is pretty invisible compared to a wire strung between two trees.

i went through this exact same thing last year. ended up putting up a homebrew vertical on a painters pole in the corner of the yard, about 33 feet of wire with 4 elevated radials at maybe 8 feet. compared to my inverted V which had similar height issues as yours... honestly the vertical felt a bit better for DX but worse for regional stuff which is basically what the books say would happen so not a huge revelation lol. neighbors havent said anything and the HOA hasnt noticed so theres that at least.

I have a similar issue with height. I am able to squeeze in an 75, 40, 20, 10 fan dipole but the center height is only about 19' and I had to drop the ends~4' each and ended up at about 6' on 75, definitely NVIS, suits me for the nets I want to participate in. 40 gets OK DX at times. 20 is great. 10 is so, so. I think because of the way I wound my choke - primarily for 75/40. I used an end fed with a balun and got great results with 63' of wire. I had to use a tuner but my signal reports were good. Top end was about 19' and lower end about 8'. Build a wire antenna and give it a try. If you have the capability you might consider a horizontal loop. They are very quiet usually. Good luck, 73, de n1plv